Fighting City Hall

[ltccuster]

Unfortunately I don't think we can recall the mayor or city councilpersons.
We've needed that right for a long time. Once they get their butts in there it takes 4 years until the next election to get rid of them and then, as we can see with some councilpeople now, they show up again. Some of the worst ones have been re-elected in the past. With low voter turn-outs and just 51% of that low turnout deciding the election that's how we get what we have. We often have candidates run unopposed. They get in regardless of how bad they are. If they're in the "good ole boy" group that helps.

You can sign a petition and present it to them. What they do with it is another matter. We definately need more public control and oversight over city government. But .... with public apathy and few people even bothering to attend council meetings or council committee meetings they do pretty much whatever they want.

Remember when the city gets sued it's our money (taxdollars) that the city has to dole out to the plaintiffs in any settlement. If you just want the court to order the city to do something it should do but isn't you might consider a Writ of Mandamus. Disclaimer is NOT to be mistaken for legal advice. Just some kind of legal document I once heard about during laymen idle chit chat. As I recall a former city attorney once filed one of these against the city.

[mfish]

1) Roswell has no "recall" provision. It needs a "city charter" in order to have a recall provision. Roswell has no city charter.
2) Recalls are very expensive and as a rule, not very successful - unless blatant malfesance can be proven (getting CAUGHT with your hand in the cookie jar, or with a six year old Filippino boy, for instance).
3) Getting 10,000 signatures on a petition will be a chore - have you looked to see how many people actually bothered to vote in the last city election...? And, the signatures will have to come from residents within the city limits.
4) Getting a petition with several hundred names (or even 2 - 3,000) would be a nice visual aid to use when you approach the council, as then you're acting as representative of several thousand people, so that would be an excellent thing to have. And a few thousand - or even several hundred - names are easier to get than tens of thousands. But ltccuster is right - what they end up doing with the peition once you've presented it is anyone's guess. LaGrone or Maples may decide to use it as toilet paper in the interest of "going green" and doing their part in the recycling effort ...

[Daisy]

WOW, I guess it really is damned near impossible to fight city hall, huh? Swado has been telling us just that for a long while now. So, what ARE our options? I, personally don't plan to spend any of my money on a lawyer to sue the city. It looks like it doesn't work, anyway and like ltccuster said, they use OUR money to fight it.

So, do we really have to wait 4 years - it's kinda looking that way.

By the way, saw, thanks for the Police Dept. info............hmmm, how did I know that Roswell's would not be up to date.

[Swadlo]

There is only one thing we can do.

Start right now, and put together a a group to run for city council , All 5 seats and a new mayor. And vote the bums out of office and do it again at the next election. The old group has started doing just that, by bringing stubbs and maples back to get their group back in office. Either we do this or just shut up and stop complaining. It is time to PUT UP or SHUT UP. DO WE DO IT OR NOT. Now is the time to act.

ELECT A ROSWELL REFORM GROUP

No more BS, let's do this or get off the subject.

One man's opinion
Swadlo

[mfish]

You can replace half of the city council in two years - AND the Mayor (who probably won't run for re-election anyway - But I wouldn't be surprised if Stubbs threw her hat into that ring ... that's a job she really wants, and hasn't had the chance to screw up yet, like most of the other positions she's held over the years).

So - you need to have FIVE GOOD COUNCIL CANDIDATES - SIX, if Stubbs jumps ship and runs for Mayor. In two years. So you'd better start recruiting NOW. You need to find people who feel committed (no Ragsdale bail outs after it's too late for someone else to enter the race - Ragsdale paved the way for Maples to win by doing that), and someone who is willing to spend the time and raise the money (sorry, Timothy Dominguez, but you basically guaranteed Stubbs a victory when you didn't do either). "Single issue" candidates never do well, either. Pick five or six areas of concern among the citizens where the current council members have dropped the ball and hammer them home at every opportunity. Challenge the incumbents to REAL town hall meetings and debates. You can hold those at the Library's auditorium, for instance - and make sure you invite the press.
If all five (or six) candidates run on common ground, you can build a coalition of sorts, and share expenses on newspaper ads, where all five or six pictures are presented as the candidates for positive change in Roswell.
There's no guarantee that "your" candidates will win - Billy Wood was committed, spent the time AND money and lost narrowly to "Hand-out-son" (er, Henderson) - but he gave Henderson a run for his money.

HOWEVER - you'll NEVER change the council if you don't find those candidates.

[ltccuster]

I agree that a good electable slate of candidates be selected and their campaigns adequately funded long before the 2010 elections.

We're going to be left with the worst 5 incumbent councilpeople in my opinion at that time. Judy Stubbs will likely make another run for mayor. Either way we're stuck with her for more years. Unless she finds another gov'mt program elsewhere where she can get a job with a fancy job title.

A slate of five willing electable candidates should be in place with yard signs, etc. before candidate filing day. Hopefully all five can get elected and offset the votes of the other five. We should also have a good mayoral candidate ready to run by then.

The problem is in finding the willing candidates who are articulate, well-versed on key city issues, with the time it takes to properly serve their constituency. Otherwise, once elected they'll soon fall into the same trap as most and end up being little more than rubber yes stamps for city staff. Or they may start off hard-charged and working for you, taking the time to check into your inquiries and complaints but slowly drift into being burned out and just go along with whatever the city mgr & city staff want.

We've seen from the past that even when a mayor wants to get rid of the city manager he cannot do it and it ends up costing the city huge attorney fees. Ideally a new slate would have a mayoral candidate and five good council candidates.

We may blah-blah about this and know how important it is but actually finding the candidates and doing something tangible to make it happen is the challenge. This won't be a free ride. These candidate need contributions.

[Swadlo]

Swadlo - he wouldn't have needed the council had he released Capps that first day.

I must disagree with you. Tom Jennings had the deal stacked against him from the get-go. But it did show the true color of the city council. Or have you forgotten the ordeal that came about after Tom appointed Sandra Collins to replace the out going councilman from Ward IV.

Stubbs reclused herself from the vote and that woman worked with Sandra. Mary Aniya was one of the worst. Maples, the so called preacher had the audacity to say he wanted to interview her to make sure she was qualified. Sandra Collins had a uphill battle all the was. Stubbs and maples stabbed her in the back on more than one occasion. It is no wonder that she did not seek a second term.

What scared the hypocritical city council members, in my opinion it was the simple fact that Sandra Collins was a "SUCCESSFUL BLACK LADY" and the powers that be were scared to death of the lady because she tried to help the people of Roswell. Yes they were prejudice in my book.

In my opinion Sandra Collins was one of the best council members we have had in a long time.


If we do nothing , the same people who put stubbs and maples back in office will fill up the seat with more of the same. And we can blame no one but ourselves.

My opinion

Swadlo

[mfish]

While we're waiting for Lees to enlighten us on this man "Rafferty," let me address Swadlo's comments.
Yes - you are correct when you state Jennings had the deck stacked against him from the get-go. And yes, you are correct when you state that Sandra Collins got the shaft regarding her appointment, and yes, she was probably one of the brightest and most capable people to ever be considered for a council position - that in and of itself was enough to terrify the knuckleheads who sat on that dias at the time.
But had Jennings released Capps of his duties as his first act of business as Mayor, the council would have had no say in the matter. Jennings just waited too long to attempt the removal of Capps. There's a mysterious portion of the city by-laws that give the Mayor limited authority on matters such as this (key city employees) - but the Mayor MUST act as soon as sworn in, or the matter then goes before the council for an up or down vote. Go research this - I did when this all happened and this is how I remember the provision to read. Jennings hesitated, trying to keep things on an even keel - but the pirates pulled a mutiny and he got planked in the process.

[Swadlo]

There's a mysterious portion of the city by-laws that give the Mayor limited authority on matters such as this (key city employees) -

That mystery, IT IS CALLED NO CITY CHARTER.







If Tom Jennings had tried to do as you say, he would have lost just as bad,if not worse. You must realize Tom had to have the vote of the city council. He was voted down 9-1 I believe.. The city council was a self interested and with one agenda in mind, Taking care of the people who PULLED THE STRINGS. Did you not notice how well the city council worked with John Capps after the puppet Bill Owens got elected.
If we continue to dig at one another as we are doing now we might as well give up and let the stubbs, the maples and the Henderson's do what ever they want. But when we do that we will no longer have the right to complain about what is going on with/in Roswell.

A question mfish, Why is it going to take until Sept-Oct to find out how much money the city wasted on the UFO BS. There is no way that I believe it takes the city that long to add up the figures. It is nothing but a ploy hoping the folks will have forgotten about it by then.

We need to stop the BS or shut up about it. If we Waite until March 2010 we might as well not wast our time, effort and money. Let's Get real folks. Let's do it or shutup about it.

Swadlo